Ke30/55 Chassis Strength

[greenmac80]

Hey all been researching some ways to strengthen my chassis!

front strut bars are available!

i remember ages ago quarter panel braces are available from somewhere can't rmember where!

but that only takes care of the front!

 

what can be done about the rear?

 

i was thinking maybe a farmgate style frame made outta chro mo bolted betweent the chassis rails in the rear?

 

would a shocker brace do anything? not much in the way of tower in the rear!

 

anythoughts?

 

seam welding is an option but i don't' think i have the patience nor the equipment available.

 

foam filling the rails can have dtrimental results i hear.

 

so yeah! lets dicuss designs and possibities?

[Redwarf]

What are you planning to do with it?

 

strut bars are good.

 

Rear I really can't see the point. Have you had a look at what the shocks mount to? At the end of the day your liable to get more flex from your leaves than any movement from the chassis.

 

Seem welding is good, but would bother if it's not a competition car.

 

Why would you foam fill the rails?

 

A decent roll cage will do about 10 times more for chassis regidity than any of the above suggestions. Like this one I prepared earlier: http://www.rollaclub.com/board/index.php?s...st&p=239138

[greenmac80]

hmm its gonna be a daily. so cage is kinda outts the question. unless a half cage will work and look neat?

by the time i'm totally finished with my 20v i want to be cranking 150kwatw.

i want to strengthen the chassis to make the egnineering a bit easier.. the test the chassis rigidity whether or not it can handle the power.

so with some bracings i figure it'll help.

 

also hill climbs etc. are things i do all the time! soo much fun and i want the car to handle really well.

stiff suspension isn't a biggie. suspension was stiff before. but done on the dodge.

 

by simply using a strut bar in the front won't that promote understeer?

maybe like s strut bar from shakle mount to shakcle mount?

ore somehow brace the leaf springs to the chassis to prevent sidways torsion?

 

or am i waay off?

 

there are aftermaket bracings for newer cars that involve strengthening both front and rear just thinking why this wouldn't be

applicable to our cars?

[greenmac80]

foam filling the rails hardens them.

maybe foam is the wrong word.

 

but it can make the car super stiff and handle well but upon sudden impact the rails will snap instead of bending

[Redwarf]

The very FIRST thing you have to do is sort spring, shocks and sway bars. If you don't sort them, everything else is pointless.

[greenmac80]

ok so far i have.

mx62 struts with gas shocks so meant for 6cyl quite stiff

also 50% stiffer and lowered springs up front.

 

have reset leafs with extra pack.

pedders is adding an anti tramp bar as well.

 

gas shockers. really want stiffer but i got no idea what will fit?

 

planned to buy a whiteline 60% uprated adjustable for the front.

 

rear 60% uprated sway bar.

 

i reckon for suspension there isn't much more i can do except for rear shocks. any idea? trd ones are hard to come by.

 

so then that leaves chassis stuff.

[cuzzo]

I'm making 200kw atw. no noticable chassis twist but i havent measured it. Its very possible it is twisting.

 

Remember the more you strenghten the chassis the more snap over steer you can have (depending on driving style of course)

[Redwarf]

ok so far i have.

mx62 struts with gas shocks so meant for 6cyl quite stiff

also 50% stiffer and lowered springs up front.

 

have reset leafs with extra pack.

pedders is adding an anti tramp bar as well.

 

gas shockers. really want stiffer but i got no idea what will fit?

 

planned to buy a whiteline 60% uprated adjustable for the front.

 

rear 60% uprated sway bar.

 

i reckon for suspension there isn't much more i can do except for rear shocks. any idea? trd ones are hard to come by.

 

so then that leaves chassis stuff.

 

If you want to play with the big boys, you need to play with expensive toys.

 

Saying "gas shockers" doesn't really give us much, as does saying 50% uprated springs. Poundage (kilo-age?) is a better way of discribing it.

 

Koni or Bilstein is what you should be looking at. Billie's will probably set you back the thick end of $1000. The good thing is is that they can be tweaked and rebuilt to suit your application. Springs would be worth looking at. Tarmac set-up you'd probably be wanting at least 250lb in the front. I usually don't touch swaybars, but I have different applications to you.

 

Do things one at a time. If you change them all, and it handles like shit, you don't know what caused it. Play with front end geometry. Ausca62 picked up 2 secs a run at Gippy Hillclimb by playing with the front end.

 

Shock adsorbers are there to absorb shock, not to make the car stiffer. Just remember, too stiff suspension will lead to the car not absorbing bumps, but going over the top of them, which can lead to badness. You need to find that happy place in between.

 

Is this 20V N/A or turbo? Either way I don't think it'll be pleasant to drive as a daily.

 

 

Once you have your suspension sorted, then contemplate other more radical thoughts.

[greenmac80]

thanks redwarf! your giving me the info i'm kinda after!!

 

shockers in the front are gabriel ultras considering upgrading but they are b/n.

 

not meaning to play with the big boys. i just frequently do hill runs and you gotta be quick.

 

i want the car nice and stable.

 

i wish i could get kilo ig i'll ask today actually!

 

there was a suspension tech article somewhere?

was it here or ae86dc? explaining about snap understeer etc. spring rate etc.

 

oh if you know what the stock spring rate is in a corolla then from there you can work out 50% stiffer.

 

so basically daily/recreational hill runs

 

the 20v will be na at first. then when funds permit turbo.

[KE30_KE35_KE55]

I wrecked this ke30 with rear chassis damage, Looking at the weak point of the chassis may help you decide how to improve your chassis.

[philbey]

I'd be crossbracing up that leaf bracket first of all! and maybe a panhard rod style of setup.

 

I really don't think you'll see any benefit from whacking in a couple of braces here and there, other than a strut brace. You're talking about a lot of effort for benefit you wont see on your self proclaimed daily driver.

 

As for the foam, you're getting mixed up between chassis stiffening and collision protection - the foam is/would be used to absorb any collision energy, not to stiffen the chassis.

[corollaart]

Holy sugar tell me it hit somethink hard side ways. :hmm:

[the_random_hero]

If you're a Toymods member, check out MWP's TA22 Celica - he's done quite a bit of chassis work to prep it for a nice torquey V8.

[altezzaclub]

Foam-filling the rails adds stiffness, we used to do it to the rally cars.

 

They never lasted long enough to see if it caused rust after 10years...

 

If you want to see how the rails flex, cut the roof off!