Timings Retarded..

[hilux05]

hey people.

I'm still having probs with my 4age in my ae71, but this time it seems to be the ignition/distributor.

 

when i go to start it, it starts at around 20deg advanced and coughs and farts and just generally shit but then when i start it again its all ok, until i try to rev it and thats when the ignition retards its self instead of advancing....apparently.

we tried to swap the red and white wire over of the three but it just wont start.

 

so i was just wondering if anyone else had encounterd this strange problem and what the heck i should do!! :lolcry:

 

its just an adm ae82 bigport blue top with tvis still attached ( i think) with all rwd stuff put on with a jdm ae86 loom running a adm ecu (i also have a jdm ecu but it has the same probs).

 

thanks in advance

 

Richie..

Edited November 21, 2007 by hilux05

[KE30_KE35_KE55]

hey people.

I'm still having probs with my 4age in my ae71, but this time it seems to be the ignition/distributor.

 

when i go to start it, it starts at around 20deg advanced and coughs and farts and just generally shit but then when i start it again its all ok, until i try to rev it and thats when the ignition retards its self instead of advancing....apparently.

we tried to swap the red and white wire over of the three but it just wont start.

 

so i was just wondering if anyone else had encounterd this strange problem and what the heck i should do!! :lolcry:

 

its just an adm ae82 bigport blue top with tvis still attached ( i think) with all rwd stuff put on with a jdm ae86 loom running a adm ecu (i also have a jdm ecu but it has the same probs). it quite embarrasing really as I'm doing this because the mechanics doing the wiring and has no clue as to why its doing it, so i better get a discount....

 

thanks in advance

 

Richie..

 

Does it have a centrifical advance ?

Can you twist the rotor button about 15 degrees?,

Does it spring back?

[hilux05]

Does it have a centrifical advance ?

Can you twist the rotor button about 15 degrees?,

Does it spring back?

 

 

i wouldnt have a clue if it has centrifugal advance or any thing, as far as i know its just came with the motor its got 2 round gears inside it under the rotor i can move it a little say 1-2 mm but yeah its a little hard to check cause the cars is at the mechanics shop.

 

but if it did have centrifugal advance, what would i do about that??

 

Richie

[KE30_KE35_KE55]

i wouldnt have a clue if it has centrifugal advance or any thing, as far as i know its just came with the motor its got 2 round gears inside it under the rotor i can move it a little say 1-2 mm but yeah its a little hard to check cause the cars is at the mechanics shop.

 

but if it did have centrifugal advance, what would i do about that??

 

Richie

 

I don't Know if GE have centrifical advance I know they have electronic spark advance.

 

Pictured is a pair of distributer centrifical weights as the rotor spins they fly out turning the rotor button on the shaft advancing spark, If they are assembled wrong they can retard spark as they turn the rotor button the opisite direction. they can also get stuck and don't turn. Under the rotor button there us a felt pad that lubricates the top shaft put some oil on it.

Toyota factory Distributor's centrifical weights have two different size springs they must be put a certain way.

[towe001]

Tried the igniter and coil ?

 

Bit of a shame that you can't see what the trouble code is

[towe001]

Nar the ge motors don't have centrifical advance its electronic

[hilux05]

yeah it looks nothing like that but that looks pretty cool how it swigns out an shit .

 

cheers guys

Edited November 21, 2007 by hilux05

[Taz_Rx]

I don't Know if GE have centrifical advance I know they have electronic spark advance.

 

Pictured is a pair of distributer centrifical weights as the rotor spins they fly out turning the rotor button on the shaft advancing spark, If they are assembled wrong they can retard spark as they turn the rotor button the opisite direction. they can also get stuck and don't turn. Under the rotor button there us a felt pad that lubricates the top shaft put some oil on it.

Toyota factory Distributor's centrifical weights have two different size springs they must be put a certain way.

 

You can't assemble a dizzy the wrong way and get mechanical retarn instead of advance!! They work on a thread system, so you'd have to reverse the thread to get this result, which would bloody near be impossible.

The only way the mechanical advance system could give you a retarding effect is if you set the timing with the weights stuck out, then gave it a rev and they free'd up and sprung back.

The felt bad you refer to is ONLY in points ignition systems. This is what opens the points off the square part of the shaft. You should be putting GREASE on this, not oil as well.

 

BUT......

GE's don't have mechanical advance! They have a locked shaft and the ECU does the advancing.

Did a little bit of playing with a GE like nearly a year ago, so I can't remember heaps, but it wasn't like setting a normal dizzy.

Timing had to be set on like 15-20o before, but before you could do that you have to earth out a couple of pins on the ECU wiring.

 

To me it sorta sounds like you were on the right track reversing the wires, but are you 100% sure you swapped the right 2?

[beerhead]

Sounds like the igniter could be shagged. Try removing the IGF wire from the igniter and see if there is any change. If the ecu doesn't get the IGF signal after a couple of rotations of the motor the ecu will go into limp. If you don't get any difference running without the IGF that'll be the problem.

 

Try starting it without the map sensor too, does it behave the same way?

[KE30_KE35_KE55]

 

TazRx how many distributors have you rebuilt recurved ?

Edited November 27, 2007 by KE30_KE35_KE55

[Taz_Rx]

fug'd with plenty of K dizzies. Was helping a mate with thew GE ages ago.

 

Why do you ask?

[KE30_KE35_KE55]

You can't assemble a dizzy the wrong way and get mechanical retarn instead of advance!! They work on a thread system, so you'd have to reverse the thread to get this result, which would bloody near be impossible.

The only way the mechanical advance system could give you a retarding effect is if you set the timing with the weights stuck out, then gave it a rev and they free'd up and sprung back.

The felt bad you refer to is ONLY in points ignition systems. This is what opens the points off the square part of the shaft. You should be putting GREASE on this, not oil as well.

 

Lubrication is important, it is important you understand the distributer components and what they are for if you are going to rebuild them.

 

1 pic a felt pad on an electronic ignition. commonly called a grease stop used to lubricate. You will find it in any Toyota / Gregory's service manual.

 

2 the thread system you refer to is a thread on the shaft also used to lubricate the shaft not set the top shaft direction.

 

I have been told 4AGE do have a fixed shaft. but certainly most electronic dizzys should be lubricated especially after after a rebuild.