oldeskewltoy

This car build actually began as an engine build... back in 2008. I was determined that a 16V 4AGE could plant similar power as a 20V, given similar circumstances (compression, cam duration and lift, and engine management), while maintaining local emissions compliance. I began my build with a few essential bits of information.... 1) the smallport 4AGE head was superior to a largeport head, 2) a 7 rib block was much stouter then a 3 rib block, 3) The "feel" of the earlier engine(3 rib equipped) was snappier. 1) "Smallport", "largeport"... 2 different port configurations for the 4AGE 4 cylinder... the top 2 views show largeport, the bottom view is a smallport. The smallport head provided similar peak lift flow (volume), while improving on port velocity. 2) 3 rib block is upside down. The red marks in the 7 rib block show all the either added, or increased strengthening done to better carry a high rpm rotational assembly So... If the block is stronger, and the head is better on the newer engines... why did everyone report that the earlier engines felt snappier??? It all has to do with MASS The earlier 3 rib engines used different cranks and rods... MUCH lighter crank(a kilo :wtf:) and..... MUCH lighter rods (nearly 3 ounces lighter per rod :bounce: ) Oh... some of you might be asking yourself... "Why did Toyota add a kilo to the crank, and 3 ounces to each rod?".... the answer is because Toyota introduced the 4AGZE and they overbuilt the bottom end to cope with any issues the supercharged engine(4AGZE) might develop. Are the wheels turning yet in your mind??? What would happen if I mixed the 2 engines?? Use the superior designed head and block, along with the lightest OEM internals. Now a small There is SOME confusion about what an original TVIS 4AGE actually is... and the original power output. In reality ONLY Singapore, and some none emissions areas in Europe actually got TVIS 4AGE engines... the rest of the world all got TVIS 4AGEC engines. The "C" = catalyst equipped, which meant 9.4 to 1 compression ratio. Singapore, and those non emissions sections of Europe, got no cats, and got 10 to 1 pistons. (TVIS = Toyota Variable Intake System - a set of butterflies in the intake tract to add or subtract air - a method of increasing the intake air velocity) (all numbers measured @ the crank) 4AGEC engines 112hp to 115hp depending on application(transverse, or longitudinal), and management (AFM or MAP based) 4AGE engine 125hp now over..... Why that little tid bit of 4AGE info??? Because along with lighter weight, the earlier rods have smaller big and small ends then their heavier siblings. This requires finding an appropriate piston... one that raises compression with no downside about its crown (almost all aftermarket "on the shelf" 4AGE pistons are total garbage... they are designed for big valves, and as such usually have too steeply raked a crown) Sooooo.... along with the newer head and block, and the older crank and rods... I had to find myself a set of TVIS 4AGE (no "C") pistons.... Next..... crank and rods..... before I go too far, I'll be using "smaller", or "little" these terms refer to the crankshaft rod journals. The earlier crankshaft has 40mm rod journals, while the later, or newer crankshaft used 42mm rod journals. Below are the 2 crankshafts offered by Toyota for the 4AG. The top one is the lighter one(available from 1983 to mid 1987). Note in the bottom one(yellow lines) the larger counter weight on #2 and #4 mains, this is where much of that extra kilo is..... To quickly answer your questions...... yes the bottom crank is stronger.... but "stronger" is relative, the top (smaller) crank once properly finished is more than adequate enough for rpms levels upto 8500. The larger crank is capable of rpm levels around 9500. An interesting little factoid... the famous TRD crank... capable of rpm levels exceeding 14,000 rpm.... is another kilo HEAVIER then even the heavy OEM crank!!! And they can break too :argh: I said, "once properly finished"..... like this one. The crank below has been balanced and hardened, it also has had all the journals micro-polished. Now to the rods... 4AG rods... there were 4 kinds from Toyota... only the one on the far left fits the smaller (40mm rod journal) crank... That rod has a mass of about 459 grams, the rod just to the right weighs about 526 grams... there is 67 grams less mass in the "little" rod. That is per rod... :wtf: When the rods get the same treatment that the crank got.... they end up a bit under 455 grams... and stronger. Now... add in a wrist pin that is another 23 grams lighter still... (non OEM)... and you now have a recipe for very light 4AGE engine internals both rotation-ally... AND more importantly from a reciprocating POV. The easier it is to start, stop, and start again (rod and piston in motion) the quicker the throttle, and the easier all the parts survive. So... that is the bottom end.... not a lot special down here... and only one special, or extra part... a light weight wrist pin..... Next post I'll look at the head....... :popcorn:

Sooooooooooo......... Let me tell you the story of Surreptitious.... a "lowly" E7 Corolla sport coupe.... 7th generation Toyota Corolla - http://i79.photobuck...7thgengroup.jpg Powered by one of those... 16V 4AGEs that uses mostly stock parts..... ..... and yet now plants about 30%-45% more power then a typical 16V...(145whp) while MAINTAINING over 30mpg on the highway :lovin: AND being emissions compliant!! :party: That uses a 6 speed from an Altezza/IS200, modified with a conversion kit from LEEN. Oh... and concerning suspension and braking... I've got that pretty well covered too... with a complete AE86 suspension and 4 wheel disc brakes. More to come.... :D

as did I....... :POSTPICS!: (hope the "this thread is worthless without pics" emoticon shows...) so I'll add one...

Thanks!...Your filter is a bit larger... I'm using a Ford airbox(from a mid 80s V6 powered Ford Ranger) on my car and it uses this filter http://www.knfilters...x?prod=33-2002.

What is the dimensions of the airfilter that fits that box?? I see it is fitted with what appears to be a K&N, which K&N??

I'd be willing to bet the ITB assemblies are no longer synchronized. There are 2 separate procedures for synchronizing, one is determining throttle stops, and engagement, the other has to do with idle bypass. As far as tuning does your microtech unit have a self tuning feature? Many of the modern aftermarket ECUs can tune based on a wideband oxygen sensor reading, and a database of AFR targets...

Is it important to keep it "period correct"? Do you want an engine that was available at the time your car was built, or would you swap in a newer engine if that fits your criteria???

I've never had a 4K... but the Starlets in the USA were all rated well into the 30+ mpg range. Folks with Blacktop 20V engines (unmodified, or CORRECTLY modified) can pull over 35mpg in normal driving. my modified 16V smallport pulls about 30mpg, but I still need to tune for MPG.....

I'm pretty sure the bell housing is for a 4AGE equipped car, the throwout fork opening is on the side not shown, that is the location for cars that came equipped with the 4AGE... because if the opening, and fork were on the other side... they would interfere with the exhaust.

agreed... this isn't for everyone..... but for $3400* you get a bolt in ready 6 speed - adapters, shifter relocation, clutch disc and J160 - all included. * - $3400 also includes shipping from Ireland to the USA, shipping to other places may change the cost. As you stated, the niteparts and the J160 sets you back $1500 and doesn't include the shifter relocation, nor a properly spline 200mm, or 212mm clutch disc, nor shipping. One question - Does the Niteparts plate necessitate a input shaft extension? The LEEN does, and it, along with the input shaft bearings are included. edit - Again I do apologize to the OP for this thread diversion... (background)The AZ6 project was my idea way back in 2006, and I tried to pull it off without success(over $7000 spent on devlopment). LEEN took up the challenge, and once completed for the original client(over $10,000 spent), I got involved and have been assisting with its continued development. So when B.L.Z.BUB referred to it as a "pity" it did get my hackles up, because we have invested a great deal of time and money to bring this option to the T50 plagued owners. As far as AZ6 gear ratios.... S15 6 spd 3.626 2.200 1.541 1.213 1.000 0.767 NISMO 2.907 1.989 1.537 1.218 1.000 0.862 RX8 6 spd 3.760 2.269 1.645 1.187 1.000 0.843 Miata 6-spd 99- 3.760 2.269 1.645 1.257 1.000 0.843 SXE10 6 sp 3.874 2.175 1.484 1.223 1.000 0.869 <---- J160 TRD(33030-SE100) 3.106 2.175 1.585 1.223 1.000 0.869 T50 3.587 2.022 1.384 1.00 0.861 T50TRD1 2.341 1.607 1.195 1.00 0.886 T50TRD2 2.630 1.891 1.384 1.00 0.861 FRS 3.626 2.188 1.541 1.213 1.000 0.767 Oh... didn't you know the GT86/FRS/BRZ uses a version of the AZ6??? Almost ALL the same ratios as the S15 version...... Some more info.... LEEN has done some experimenting.... the S15 6th gear can be fitted inside the J160 transmission. This means the O/D can be improved further... Additionally we believe... but as yet not tested, that any gear from any version can be used together. And even more information.... The J160(Altezza/IS200) outer case is the strongest/stoutest of the lot (S15, Altezza/IS200, Miata, RX8), the other 3 (both Mazdas, and the Nissan) use a slightly smaller case.... Here is a photo showing the Nissan bell section fitted to an RX8 transmission

I'm not unduly irate(maybe a little :jason: ) ... just felt your chose of word ("pity") was petty and condescending.... So with out the attitude..... Why?? Why must it fit a GZE clutch/flywheel? Correct me if I'm wrong, but the GZE flwheel is heavy, and only needed to fit inside the E series transaxle. As far as hold capability, there are all sorts of stronger conventional pressure plates, and if you are really expecting a need for a strong clutch, bigger isn't better... smaller is..... apologies to OP.... for the thread jack

This guy doesn't think its a pity.... Hasselgren 240+hp 4AGE....

Pity????? Why a pity?? I'm running 212mm stock clutch w/blacktop flywheel on my 145whp(170hp@ the crank) smallport... and I don't have any clutch problems...... His Silvertop uses the same diameter flywheel. The original kit was developed for a 4AGZE powered AE86...... full artilce in link below photo http://www.gearboxco...e Optimised.pdf Take a tour of LEEN's webpage, and development - http://www.gearboxconversion.com/

not sure how much you are investing in the transmission.... one solution(in use in my AE71)... a LEEN modified J160 6 speed... LEEN takes the Toyota J160 6 speeds from Altezza's, and Lexus IS200's, and makes an enclosing front adapter that will accept a T50 bellhousing... here is the modified J160 with the front adapter mounted, and the relocated shifter to fit directly into the stock T50 shifter hole in the floor In my car... I decided to modify the floor - extending the shifter opening rearward, and in so doing improve the shifter positioning...

edit - WHOOOPS... just say I did most of this update last year.... Lots changed in 5 years... :bounce: Powered by 160+ hp 4AGE... fitted with a J160 6 speed from an Altezza/IS200 with a Richmond Racing 3.9 final drive, inside an AE86 disc brake rear axle assembly... with TRD bushings all around, custom lower control arms, :wootjump:

a coupe of videos from my car.... short rides... better video, around the block...... worse video, but pretty good sound

Not that I've seen in any of the US market wiring diagrams... **IF** I need it, I'l ask... thank you!

Ahh... so the scan above (in posting #3) is not from a European manual, but from the USA/Canada manual?

did they put the wiring into the body manual??? When I bought my AE71, I got the FSM, and the FS wiring manual too

For those that are interested.... AE86 chassis measurements.... AE71 chassis measurements....

Parrot - THANK YOU!!!! I did some additional searching... and found what appears to be a pull out diagram from a T18... which apparently = a Corolla liftback

I've recently acquired a European zenki TE72 GT instrument cluster. I'm hoping to figure out the wiring so I can properly get it installed in my 1983 AE71... I have the US wiring book - it shows the wires going to each specific pin on the plugs. I'm looking for this same section for the 1980 TE72

There's always the LEEN converted J160 6 speed........ :thumbsup:

What chassis is this 20V going into? What diameter are the exhaust ports? I'd shoot for the exhaust port diameter, and then add 4mm to 6mm, and that should be your ID target for the pipe. As far as length, 28" corresponds to more of a street engine, for a worked 20V, I'd think your target length will be closer to 26"

a bit closer.... and all lit up when done.... ;)